Welcome to the 5th season of Art for All, the Sketchbook Skool podcast .
Join Danny Gregory and this season's cohost, Jill Badonsky, as they discuss creative blocks and challenges and how to get it together, get inspired, and get to work.
Today we discuss:
Why is it so hard to get started on a new project? Whether it's beginning a new sketchbook or writing the first sentence of a novel, starting has a unique set of challenges.
Each episode is recorded in front of a live audience that YOU can join each Wednesday at 10 am PT.
Bring your questions about your creative process, blocks, challenges, and problems.
Art for All is also available as a video podcast on the Sketchbook Skool channel on YouTube:
Welcome to the 5th season of Art for All, the Sketchbook Skool podcast .
Join Danny Gregory and this season's cohost, Jill Badonsky, as they discuss creative blocks and challenges and how to get it together, get inspired, and get to work.
Today we discuss:
Why is it so hard to get started on a new project? Whether it's beginning a new sketchbook or writing the first sentence of a novel, starting has a unique set of challenges.
Each episode is recorded in front of a live audience that YOU can join each Wednesday at 10 am PT.
Bring your questions about your creative process, blocks, challenges, and problems.
Art for All is also available as a video podcast on the Sketchbook Skool channel on YouTube:
Hi there, and welcome to the Art for All podcast. I'm your host, Danny Gregory, the founder of Sketchbook School, and this is the Sketchbook School podcast. And this is the beginning of a brand new season here at Art for All. And because I have., um, kind of a short attention span. I tend to kind of reshuffle the deck periodically on this, on this podcast, and we're starting a brand new format. And I have a brand new host, co-host as well. So I want you to meet Jill Bodansky. Hi Jill.
jill:Hi Danny. Good to be here.
danny:Glad to have you here. So Jill is a coach and she is an author and she is an artist, and she is, um, a part you, you've actually been a, um, a, a guest on this podcast in the past. So you have now graduated from guest status to co-host status. Congratulations on that.
jill:Thank you. It's, it's, uh, a good, good to be
danny:here an honor. I know, I know. Don't you seem very excited and that's good. So, Jill, you've, you've done podcasts before. You, you have your own podcast. Yeah. Yeah.. Mm-hmm.. I
jill:do, however, it's, it's more of a story format. So I, I tell little stories that I've made up and they're about the creative process and mindfulness, and there's all sorts of special effects. It's called amuses daydream. So, um, I didn't wanna go about trying to get guests there, so I just became my own guest. and play several different characters as well as have enlisted people, including my boyfriend, to, to also be some of the voices and characters.
danny:So that's fun. Yeah, that's fun. Well, we won't be doing that this time. We will have no., we will be the only characters here. But, um, yes, there's still some, yes. Um, we are also experimenting with a whole new way of doing this is that we are recording in front of a live audience here on YouTube. And, um, the idea behind that is to be able to address. Issues and questions that people are gonna bring to us. Questions about their creative process, maybe challenges that they're having, or, um, just things that are. on their minds when they're sitting down to make stuff. So that is the, the general format is if you have a question that you would like us to talk about, then you can, uh, if you're here, what, um, participating in the live broadcast, you can certainly put it in the comments, but also you can email it to us, you can email. Uh, anytime you want to, to podcast@sketchbookschool.com. So if you think, huh, maybe these people can help me with, with a question that I have, we, maybe we can. And that is the, the kind of the concept here. So, um, we also have, if you're shy about this and you need an additional incentive, we also are gonna be giving out door prizes. And Jill, can you talk about what the door prizes, what's, what's involved with the door prize?
jill:We will be picking from people who have asked questions about blocks and you will receive a painting of a door in the mail. So that's the door prizes. It will be a lovely, lovely picture of a door from me. Couldn't,
danny:there's a good door painting? Yes, everybody. Everybody needs an extra door painting and possibly., it's a door painting that will open and take you to new worlds. So, um, submit your questions and in whatever format you want to, and we will have a go at it sometimes. So, Um, we're also kind of dividing the show up into a few little departments, and the first department is called, well, here we go. Here's the little intro for it. It's called Creative Calisthenic of the Week. Creative Calisthenic of the week. So Joe, what is, uh, what's, what is a creative calisthenic? What can we expect from
jill:that? Well, I, I see there's a lot of people from my Facebook page and they know what the, the prompt of the day. I've been doing this about 12 years now, and it's just putting out an real imaginative off the wall question out there that has nothing to do with logic or anything. Real Well, sometimes it does, and it, I've watched people over the years and there's writers and comedians and civilians and, and all sorts of people following it who do it on a regular basis, and I see their creativity just beginning to expand because they think they're playing, they think they're doing something fun, which they are, but they're also stretching open their imagination a little bit. So, . Um, great.
danny:That's what it's, okay. So here's what we're gonna do is you are going to take us through with the challenges for today. Um, I'm going to do my best to a, to respond to it, but meanwhile, if you're in, if you're in the audience and you'd like to share, Your ideas, just, um, maybe put down CC and then write down what your response is, if you'd like to share that. And we'll come back and share some of the thoughts you've had throughout the course of the show. We'll come back to what, what that is. So, okay. So how does this work? Tell me, I mean, I understand the basic concept, but what is, what is today's creative calisthenic of the week or what is this week? And
jill:by the way, I must mention that Danny does not know what the question is. He specifically said he does not want to know the question beforehand, so he will be answering The question for today is there should be a little music here. What is the first one? Music.
danny:All right.
jill:What is the first line in your bestselling memoir of your life as a window washer?
danny:Hmm. Uh, yes. Let me think about that. What is the first line in my bestselling memoir about being a window washer? I started at the top. jill: Okay. That works. That works. So anybody else have an answer? You can check it in if you have, if you have a better answer, which I'm sure you do, just sh share it with us in the comments and we will get to that. Um, so now let's, while that is percolating the creative Calisthenic of the week, we're gonna move on to what is sort of the, we call this kind of the cover story of, uh, Of the, the thing of, of each week, which is, um, the sort of the creative problem of the week. So I'm, I'm gonna just play a little thing here. So what is the creative challenge of the equal? This week we thought that we would just talk generally about a thing that seems to plague a lot of us, and it seems apropo for today's episode, which is how hard it can be to start a new creative project. And um, I have people write to me all the time and they say anything from, I bought a beautiful new sketchbook and I'm afraid to ruin it by drawing in it. um, or I sit down to write something and I just, I can't write the first sentence. Um, or I just don't know what to make, or I don't know where to start. It all seems like too much. Do, do you, do you think that that's a pretty common thing, Jill?. jill: Absolutely. I, and I think there's a a lot of reasons why people have that problem. And a good place to start is to be aware of some of those things and see which ones that you identify with. And also to know that you're not alone. You know, Danny asked for questions and a majority of them were people having trouble starting for various reasons. And you know, some of them are real reasons, time issues, but there are solutions to that. And some of them I think, are also avoidant strategies.. So there, the fear comes up. I'm not gonna be good enough the comparison to what other people are doing. We just psych ourselves out from starting. Um, anything more you wanna say about the problem before we go into surgery? Well, we've wrestled with it a bit. I mean, Here we are. We're at the beginning of a project and there's all kinds of things that have gone through my mind and probably have gone through your mind as well as we've just talked about doing this, you know, how much preparation do we need to make? You know? Uh, it's possible to spend a lot of time just, you know, Straightening the pencils on your desk and, you know, um, going to the art supply store and buying more supplies and, well, I better go and read a couple more books. Or maybe I should take a class before I do this. And for us, you know, I thought about, well, I got very involved with all the technical aspects of. Putting this thing together. And that's kind of what was worrying me and I thought about that. But then, you know, how much preparation should we do in terms of an outline for the show? How much, um, rehearsal should we have? Should we have a lot of conversations about what we're gonna do? Should we have figured it all out? Um, you know, this, there's a sort of high wire act when you are going out and trying it for the first time where you step onto the wire and you. Okay, this has all been in my mind, I've been thinking about what it's gonna be like, but then as soon as you start to do it, it turns out to be really pretty different than you'd imagined, you know? Um, so you can over-prepare, which can then also stifle your creativity, or you can under prepare, which means you might have a lot of anxiety and preparation can sometimes help you to, to assuage your anxiety to some extent, cuz you say, Um, I will focus my nervous energy on just, you know, making lists and things like that. So that's the, that's a bit what's been going on, I think with me and, and with you. I mean, we've talked back and forth about how does this work and what should we do. So, um, like what has your experience been in just preparing for this, for this today?
jill:A lot of what you're talking about. Uh, I, I have anxiety about walking into my kitchen, so anxiety's just a, a normal part of my life. And I, I think one thing I've learned over the years is you, you really, you can't prepare for the creative process. What you can prepare for is tolerating the mistakes that happen and knowing that there's going to be mistakes. This isn't gonna go. As perfectly as we like and just knowing we will make it through that. And I don't, I think a description of, of how I feel is kind of like a pie chart. I think a third of what I'm feeling or what I was feeling is just really excitement about being able to do this, cuz it's easy to start when you have somebody asking you. To do it. I probably wouldn't be doing art for all if I hadn't been asked to do it, cuz I'd get in trouble copyright wise. So a third of it is just the excitement. Uh, a third of it is curiosity. And I, I think that's a good way to go into starting rather than comparison or fears just what's gonna happen. And if it doesn't go right, how am I gonna ha handle that? and I think, uh, a six is what have I gotten myself into now? And in, um, the last, cuz I, I get myself into these things. It's a long list, which is balanced by the excitement. And, and then the last six is probably anxiety. Um, which is probably why I'll have some pie after I eat, after I do this . So it's a good, uh, way to deal with anxiety. But yeah, I, I think it's fun and I think when you look at what's gonna be fun and creativity is fun, and it's, it's really easy to focus on the fear and, you know, I, there's anxiety around this and it's like, yeah, so what. We gotta do it anyway, cuz it's gonna be fun and it's gonna be helpful to people and it's gonna be a new experience. And all of that is the creative process.
danny:Yeah, I think that that's an important point, which is you're not gonna enjoy it until you start it. So even though that very first step might seem daunting, um, Looked forward to the future and the, and the positive things that are gonna come from it. That's certainly a beginning part of this. I think what happens a lot of times is when we sit down to begin something, our perfectionist part kicks in, and that part of it is something that has a vision of what this should be like, what, what should it be like? And then of course, as soon as you draw the first line, if you're gonna draw, do a drawing or write the first sentence immediately, you're faced with the fact that. It's not perfect. It's not as great as you thought it was gonna be out of the out of the gate, which of course is impossible. I mean, it's never gonna be the first time that you try something. It's unlikely that it's gonna be randomly as good as it could possibly be. Invariably, we have to start assuming we'll make mistakes and be okay with. Um,
jill:I, I think both of us have the philosophy of, of ready, fire, aim. It's just the more you think about something, the more you're gonna talk yourself out of it. Cuz the mind just has all sorts of reasons why we shouldn't do something and why. Just in a class yesterday, somebody was talking about wanting to write poetry for a really long time, and as soon as she started, she just, she teared up because she realized how much she loved it and how much she was putting it off for a while. And I, and I think it's, it's like that as soon as we get into the process, and like you said, Don't expect there we're, we just, a lot of us get delusional. We think it's supposed to be good right off the bat there. There's a small percentage of times that that does happen, that the first time you draw, the first time you write something good comes out of it and that messes you up for future ones because it just doesn't happen like that on a regular basis. So one of the things I teach constantly is lower your expectations. Allow yourself not only to do. Crap, but do it for just 30 seconds because a lot of people go, I have to have a block of time to start. I've gotta have a block of time and a block of time brings up fear. 30 seconds doesn't bring up as much. I'll just have to do this for 30 seconds. And then you, then you create a momentum that you get lost in. I think
danny:most of us, yeah. I mean, my advice to people often is if, if you have a brand new sketchbook and you. Are terrified of ruining it, open it and write your name in it. As soon as you do that well, you can't return it to the store. Now you've made, you've taken that first step and. And the next step might be open the, open the sketchbook in the middle. So, cause a lot of times I've had this experience where you start a sketchbook and that first, that first page has to be amazing. Um, but if you start it in the middle, you can always work your way back to the beginning later on. But if you start in the middle, is somehow less pressure because, If you screwed up, it's buried in the middle. That's fine. That's okay. That's acceptable. Um, and I think similarly with writing, a lot of times I find I'll just start writing. If I need to write something, I just start typing. And then almost invariably, when I'm done writing, once the ball has started rolling and I'm done writing, I'll go back and I'll cut off those first couple of paragraphs. knowing that they were just the warmup, you know? And so I think so often action is the key as opposed to preparation, as opposed to um, you know, procrastinating. Cuz we can find so many ways to procrastinate and they don't actually, they're not actually preparation. They are perfectionism, they're fear and plunge in because the worst thing that will happen is you'll screw up. and that is part of the learning process. This whole notion of, of a growth mindset where you are enjoying learning, which means mis making mistakes and learning from those mistakes, that that's really your objective as opposed to creating a perfect product. Uh, if you can kind of get yourself into that place, that could be a, a, a great way to just lose yourself and keep going.
jill:Mm-hmm., I, I love the idea of starting in the middle of the sketchbook. I think that's brilliant and I.. I think that if, if you start and it doesn't look good, that there's a number of ways for, for one thing, I don't know if this happens to a lot of you, but it happens to a lot of my students, and that is they'll, they'll draw thing, something, they, they won't think it's any good. They'll come back and visit it later and they'll go, this isn't that bad. and cuz they, they have a whole different perception. They didn't realize that it's, it might be different from what you were expecting, but it actually turned out pretty good. The other thing is just take stuff you do like and paste it over the stuff you don't like. give the stuff you don't like. A title make it interesting because again, I, I see so many students do stuff they don't like, but I like, um, and maybe they don't realize that they have a style that they're not expecting. And to begin to love what your style is versus comparing it to somebody else, not, you know, for me, what I teach. Is the imperfect picture is one filled with energy and mystery and story, the perfect one. It looks like something, but it doesn't have as much interest and connection to being human as the ones that aren't perfect.. So
danny:give yourself a grade. It's like, it's like color by numbers or coloring in a coloring book is if you have it all kind of mapped out in advance, then it, it'll probably feel somewhat wooden, right? You look at a paint by number set that generally don't look like incredibly exciting art. Um, so if you had everything worked out in your brain before you sat down to do it, and then you just executed it, a, the results probably wouldn't be that interesting. And B, the process of doing it probably wouldn't be that interesting. But if you go into it, with a kind of a, a, a desire to discover that. You go in thinking, okay, I know a little bit about where I'm going. But let's start going there. And then when I, as I start moving and start discovering and the things that I'm doing are reacting to these new discoveries, I'm gonna find my place, my way in, in all kinds of new and exciting and un unexpected places. It's like, It's like going to Paris and you can say, okay, I expect to see the Eiffel Tower and you know, the Louv and those kinds of things. But when you get there, if you have an open mind, you might have an adventure. You might find yourself in a really unusual place doing things that you never thought you could do or you didn't even know existed. And I think that's the mindset to go into everything that you're doing, which is try. Start it and see where it goes. That's, that's the adventure that we as artists need to be on all the time.. jill: Yeah. Lets yourself get lost in it and letting it being a, an adventure instead of a barometer of whether you're good enough. Um, you know, one, one thing I think that helps a lot of people get started because our words. are really powerful and a lot of people will say, I, I really have to sit down and do this, and the, the words I have to, and I should have an entirely different energy than I get to. I get to sit down and see what's gonna happen and I get to, you know, if I make a mistake, see how I handle it. because we're, we're not only making art, we're kind of evolving. We are creative things and, and being in the creative process is not only creating the book and the picture, it's also creating our, our stamina, our endurance, our resilience. And those things come in handy other places in our life. And they, they tend to spill over when we've had practice in art too. Yeah. Good. So, Why don't we go step by step with a person who says, what would be your advice to a person who says, um, I've been taking classes and I've been thinking for years about, um, I don't know, maybe writing a children's book or, um, I've been thinking that it would be great to open an Etsy store and make some stuff to go in it, but I still have other research to do and I just, I'm dithering. What would be the first thing that you would say to a person in that situation? Um, I, I can't get off the launch pad.
jill:I would ask them if that's ever happened to them before, because chances are, if it happens in one place, it's happened in another place. And if, if it has happened before and they've gotten through it, how did they go through it? Because then they can go back and tap into a success experience they've already had. And if, if this is something completely new and it's not something they have experience with, I'd still ask them, what do you think would work? because a lot of people don't think they have the answer and it's weird. But when you ask 'em that question, what do you think would work? They all of a sudden go to this reserve of wisdom they didn't know they had. And they have the right answer. They have a better answer that I would have. And if they're still stuck, I would go and I was talking to them in the moment, I'd go, let's do it now. I'm gonna hold the space for you.
danny:Would you? But literally right now it's. White needle. Let's,
jill:yeah. What would be a place for you to start? I'm gonna hold the space for you to do it. Um, so where, where do you think And somehow, because we're pack animals, that helps people, they feel like they have this support to go. And I think that's why classes help so much. Um, your way to start is to take classes because it's really hard to show up in a class and not get swept up in the. the energy of it, if you got the right teacher and um, you're enjoying what you're doing. But yeah, I would, um, not talk about it and maybe give a little somebody who does that, and there's a lot of people who do that. So it's not an uncommon thing is I've got to be completely prepared before I do any of that. That's a very perfectionistic approach. Right. So, Allow yourself to guess what happens, and then when you're in the process, you'll figure it out. You know, I think you're a self-taught artist, correct? Is that correct?
danny:I guess so, yes. Yeah.
jill:I, I thought that's what your little animation things,. I, I, I'm a self-taught artist and writer and I think, I, I, I, I work with so many people who have gone to art school and they're trying to unlearn some of those things so they can be more free. So be free.
danny:I also like the thought that seems to be part of what you're saying, which is what would you say to somebody else who came to you with your problem? So in other words, if you had a friend who said, , you know, I can't get started. What would you say to that person? Because so often we're really good at giving other people advice, but we're not as good at giving ourselves that same advice. So that could be also an exercise that you could do, which is to say, you know, you would say to your friend, well, what's the problem? Why aren't you starting? It's just jump in and see what happens. That might be what you say. I doubt you would say you should spend years preparing for this and putting it off.
jill:Yeah, I think that's also a great idea because you're gonna be kinder as well to a friend than you are to yourself. You're gonna, a lot of people reading the questions that they've sent you, they're all beating themselves up, and a friend's gonna go, let's just start. Just go ahead and start. You're gonna be good at it. And if you're not good, you're gonna learn how to be good. You cannot not be good. If you persist with something, you, you will figure it out. And it's less painful. Yeah.
danny:Well this is a subject we could obviously go on for a while, but we have created a very rigid format for ourselves.. We should go on and, and we'll, we will move on to the next, um, sort of stage. We'll, I'm sure we'll come back to this topic cuz it's a really, it is a, an important one and something that we have a lot. So, um, Jill, maybe while I am doing this next segment, you can be just looking through what people are saying and uh, we can get back and talk about that. I'll just some of, yeah. So, um, this here is our next section. It is our next segment. This is my book, nook. I'm calling it, I'm not sure. Because it rhymes. But, um, I'm gonna read to you just a little piece that seems a little apropo from a book that I wrote. Um, in this case, it is a book called Shut Your Monkey, how to Control Your Inner Critic and Get More Done. And It, it is the from the middle of the book. Speaking of jumping into the middle of the book is a little piece called A Neat Stall is a Sign of a Dead Horse. What happens when you're so fixated on perfection that you never begin? Never begin writing. Never begin making stuff. Never begin pursuing any sort of passion for fear of not being able to do it incredibly well. Nothing you do will be good enough, even for you. Why bother if you can't be great? A variation is fids. Constant reappraisal, erasing, tweaking, reconsidering, seeking more opinions on and on. Never done, never good enough. One of the problems with perfectionism is that you think you can conceive the destination before you embark on the journey. That you can plan it all out in advance, and that nothing else can intrude and change the outcome you've conceived. But the world doesn't work that way unless you're doing something extremely simple and banal. Something you can actually hold in your brain all at once. It will invariably intrude and change your well laid plans. And secondly, you should welcome that intrusion, the accidents, mistakes, serendipities and ink splatters that the universe throws in your path, make you and your life more interesting. Perfection isn't natural. It can be constipated and inert. Meanwhile, if you're waiting to make stuff because you haven't got the perfect pen or paper or subject or teacher, or block of time, get over it. We all make crap every day. If we didn't, we'd die or at least be really cranky . So there you have it written on, written in a book, so it must be true.
jill:Yeah, we're on the same page with cranky . I use that word a lot too. If you're not doing your creative stuff, you get cranky for sure. You do get
danny:crank. So, have we seen any the Yeah,
jill:go ahead. Yeah, I, I just, um, inadvertently made this gigantic, so I'm going through some questions.
danny:So have was I, I, I saw some pretty funny, um, Creative calisthenics. That's kind of where the stage of the show we're at, where we can look back on some of the funny things that people did in response to Oh, okay.
jill:Rather than go through some of the
danny:questions, we'll get to that next. That's, this is all cl carefully regimented. Um, that's right. So I will,
jill:Here's one. Uh, one Linda Chapman said her first line in her memoir of being a window washer is clean the window of your consciousness. Clarity about Joey Sarna said, I broke through the glass wall. Terry Jordan said, how high am I. Lata, nice name said, so dirty. But the promise of seeing kept me going. Lorraine said, I just get on with it, I guess. Uh, Angie said.. Oh, uh, well these are not all of them are, or for, this is not for the window washer. The see aren't the
danny:cc. I think we window, yeah. Stay focused folks like this one says, I can see clearly now. Yeah. Several people said, I can see clearly now when success has been streaky says, and Kenny. Kenny.
jill:Oh, that's
danny:good. Joey Sarna said I broke through the glass wall.. Yeah. Nice. Got that one. Um, so yeah, continue to add some of those, if you have some other thoughts of your creative calisthenics and ideally identify them with CC at the beginning. So, um, the next section that we're gonna talk about is called What's your Problem? So here we're gonna tackle some questions that, that you and the audience have, have asked us to, to think about, and we'll see where that takes us in these discussions. Let me just see if we, uh, Jill, were there any questions that you came upon that you felt were great?
jill:Yeah. Um, from Chris, per. I, I, sorry, I can't pronounce your last name. Per Chris p I never know what to draw. I never know what idea to start with. So that's a great question. How do you do that, Danny? How do you come up with an idea?
danny:I have to say, a lot of times I dislike the process of drawing, so a lot of times I just like drawing. So it's kind of like, running or you know, doing a lot of other kind of simple things that we do every day. Like if I was a runner, which I'm not, I, or if I was going for a walk, it wouldn't matter so much where I walked, but I would like the act of walking, the act of running. So for me, a lot of times drawing is just literally picking up a pen and my sketchbook and looking around me and saying, what could I draw? I'll draw that shoe over there. I'll draw this complex, uh, electrical wires that are lying on that, on that table. Uh, I'd want to just get into that moment. I'm not thinking I need a drawing of electrical wires. I was thinking that would be a fun thing to run my mind around and see where that goes. Or I might say, let me just look for a face on. The internet that I respond to, and that seems interesting, has nice kind of craggy wrinkles or interesting light on it. Let me just go and respond to that. So I, there are times when I'll do like an illustration project or something like that where I'm thinking much more conceptually about what it's about, but by and large, I just draw anything literally. I mean, I've drawn toilets, I've drawn bagels, I've drawn. Hmm. I drew my dog's butt the other day just from behind. So there's, there's really, to me, I love the act of drawing. And I'll start again, like we've talked about, starting with an adventure. I'll start doing it and then I'll see where it takes me. And a lot of times, once the wheels are turning, then I'll a suddenly say, okay, now that I've done my dog's butt, let me just draw her face or let me draw the shadow that she cast on the, on the bed, or let me draw. The view out the window. So I'm in that mode and my kind of scanning machine is looking around trying to scan for other subjects. That's, that's my process.
jill:Ah, my mine is, I, I don't usually sketch things in my environment, and if I do, I, I do it. I do it without looking. I do a lot of blind contours. I'm, I'm like looking right now at flowers on my window and I'm not looking at what I'm drawing. Because that just gets me started without having to be perfect. But drawing just helps me with my anxiety. So I do a lot of doodling when I'm just in general, just as leaving stuff around is a good place to start and just doodling and then those things turn into these whimsical things that, um, just are asking me to. To color them in. Sometimes when I find, oh, here's a, here's another thing I like to do. You know, a lot of people think they're copying other people's thing when they look at pest or something. So I go to the sculpture section, cuz when you're in the sculpture section, there's a lot of really cool sculpture. But when you draw it, it's no longer a sculpture. Right? And you put your own variation. On it. And if I find something I like, I'll do it over and over and over again. Um, and then each time maybe modifying it a little bit so it really does become an adventure. How can I, this time, I'm gonna put a hat on this person. This time they're gonna fly. and, and just wondering what's gonna happen next. So, but I, I do, sometimes I'll go to Pinterest and pick two images and go, how can I combine these, these two? And then it becomes a, a challenge of two things coming together. So
danny:I like that. I think also just taking something you've drawn before and drawing it again and seeing how you're different. Your skills may have changed. You may be using a different medium. You might have a different mood that you're drawing through, and so you'll come at it. differently. I've drawn the same thing hundreds of times. A coffee mug or my a self-portrait or you know, different, they're, the subject matter is less important than the process. And I think if you think to yourself, what should I draw? I think you're thinking about the finished product more than you're thinking about the, the journey. So I think, again, going back to our travel analogy, if you. Uh, an experienced traveler, you know that anywhere you go you can have an interesting adventure and it doesn't really matter., um, what your destination is, you'll figure out something cool and you'll have an interesting experience. So if you approach drawing that way, I think you'll have, um, a great time. I'm gonna move on to another question from Angie, and this is a question that's kind of the inverse of what we've been talking about. She says, starting is not as much an issue for me as I have shiny object syndrome, but sustaining my attention and finishing the project is where I would love some guidance and advice. How do you finish a creative project? What would you say to Angie?
jill:I would say I, I know I, what I'm thinking is, I'm gonna say a lot of the same things because they work, and what I would say is, have you finished a project before? And if you did, how did you finish it so it can go to her? Experience first, but I think what she's talking about is a huge problem with everybody because our concentration is fractured more than it ever has been because of the internet, cuz of email, because of texts. So they're shiny objects all over and, and people are addicted to that. And it's really important to, to acknowledge that we are addicted to. The shiny objects there. Cal Newport has written several books on it and he says it's, it's really hard to get out of that. And I know my atten, my last book was the hardest one to write cuz it's the one that happened during the advent of my addiction with, with social media. And I just had to work around it. I had to. I between shiny objects. I had to do my writing and just not beat myself up for it, but just go, okay, here I am. Distracted again, to normalize it, sometimes normalizing it, neutralizes it, and sometimes when you give yourself permission to do the shiny objects you don't want to anymore because they're competing. So when you go, okay, I'm gonna go on Facebook for several hours, and then I go, no, that's such a hollow reward, I think I'll do my. My writing for 30 seconds and then reward myself with something. So rewarding yourself with that shiny objects helps, um, just knowing you probably have the shiny object syndrome now, so work around it as best you can reward yourself anytime that you, you do show up. And how about you, Danny? What do you do for that? Well, I would
danny:say, um, perfectionism comes into play again and fear. Mm-hmm.. So for instance, I recently worked on this animated film and I realized like I could keep tweaking it forever. I could keep NuGen it, trying a different piece of music doing, showing it to a different person to get their opinion before I released it on and on and on. and what I decided was, no, I need to release it by a certain date. I need to share it regardless of what condition it's in. And I think that that's an important thing to say to yourself is the, the end of this road. Isn't finishing the project, it's, that's just the next stage, entering the next stage. Because when you work on a project and you put it out into the world, new things happen. So that's the next act that this project is gonna undergo. And if you're holding onto the first act for too long, you're waiting to publish it, you're waiting to upload it, you're waiting to send it out, then you're never gonna get to that point where people respond. People give you feedback, people will offer you opportunities, uh, all the different things that happen that will help you to learn from it and to go further. So don't think of this as the end of the project, but think of it as the beginning of a new and exciting stage that's completely out of your control. That's another thing that I think we're afraid of a lot of times is if I put it out there, I don't know what will happen. Whereas if I keep it in my, you know, in my hands and I keep tweaking and polishing it, then I will have control. So, so I think be, be willing to say, you know what, this is gonna be really cool. It might be a disaster. People might hate it, but it doesn't really, you know, it, it will be a new adventure. Let me, let me try that. So that takes a little bit of, um, you know, guts, but it's part of the process of being an artist.
jill:Good point. Yeah. I was, uh, addressing more the, the shiny object thing than finishing. And finishing is a, a big issue for a lot of people. Oftentimes I'll go and say, how many people have a bunch of unfinished projects and everybody has their, their handout. Uh, and I, I think there is a fear there. There's a perfectionism thing, but also I think there's a lot of projects that are finished even when we don't think they're finished and to, to liberate them. To, to let them go and to go. I, I, I had fun with them. Um, they gave me what I needed to and let 'em go, because when we, if you're a perfectionist, especially if you're thinking of all your unfinished projects, they're pulling your energy away. I really should finish that. I should finish that if you go, okay, that's really finished, and stick with the ones that are most important to you. And, and also en employ the, the help of a friend because there's lots of friends out there that are in the same place and be working to finish at the same time. Not to finish at the same time, but be working on your projects at the same time with the, the same goal of getting something done. Because that parallel universe time can make a huge difference in terms of sticking with it because you're holding the space for each other and the agreement is we're not gonna. Be distracted. We're gonna keep going with the thought of getting finished with
danny:this. Good. Well, um, do you wanna try and tackle one more?. One more question. Um, go ahead.
jill:I, I think that one that's come up a lot is I have so many responsibilities and I let those get in the way of doing anything. You know, I do the responsibilities first, or I work all day and then I'm tired by the end of the day and I have no, no energy left for my creativity. does that ever come up for you, Danny?
danny:Sure. I mean, I think we can do a whole episode about this, about about how you f what role your creative work takes in your life. What, what priority does it have? Um, you know, I think a lot of times we are, we feel like, um, we have to assert the value. I'm gonna sell this, so therefore it's worth my time. Or, you know, I'm gonna make this as a gift for somebody and therefore, um, I have to finish it by such and such a time. So I'm allowed to put the time into it. But if I spend too much time on my art, then I'm not doing my job. I'm not looking after my family. I'm not, you know, Doing chores around the house. I'm, I'm not doing all the millions of other things that take up our time. So I think this whole issue around guilt is something that I'd love to delve into in a future episode and to think about really, what do we do that, what is the purp? Yeah. What's the purpose of all this stuff? Why do we do it? What is its real value in our lives? I think that's something that's, that's really essential to figure out for yourself and that will also give you. An answer to the voices in your head that maybe stop you from doing it will help you to prioritize and figure out where this fits in. Will help you to set goals and know why. What you hope to get out of it, uh, will help you to define your projects. There's a lot of stuff that goes on in there, but knowing your why, why am I doing this is a pretty essential topic that probably is, is more than we can tackle in the last few minutes here, but something we should come back to. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, should we move on to Jill? You were gonna read, uh, a little passage from your book. Yeah. And this is, this is Jill's Jill's book, nook. I've gotta come up with a better name than that, but yeah,, jill: I like, I like This is, this is from the Muse is Inn, and it's, it's, uh, owner's manual to your creativity. It's based on an owner's manual to your car. But it's an on manager. So I'm just gonna read a couple of these things that seem to go with what we're talking about. This is, this is called the does just kinda like duh. And the first one is, number one, beating yourself up doesn't work. As well as being fascinated by who you are and the things you do. Constant self-deprecation works as well as hammering on a sprouting daisy when it first pops through the soil. Despite work environments where intimidation and high pressure have resulted in productivity, creativity responds to positive reinforcement, inner applause, and Hershey's Kisses., be compassionate with yourself. Creativity is fragile, but can express the depth of your soul. And bewildering Ling, brave and brilliant ways. Two, this will be my last one. You get more done when you start things than when you don't. J r r Tolkin once said, it's a job that's never started that takes the longest to finish. And along those same lines of thought, will Rogers added, even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. To start, and this is important, point yourself in the direction of your creative adventure and take a step. That's all you have to do. Just point yourself to your studio. One step leads to the next, but sometimes just one step in and of itself is better than none. So those are uses in, those are really, those are, that's, that's great advice. And meanwhile, I have been trolling through the, the. comments to pull up a few more of our creative calisthenics. Sarah Long says, most people would say that they experienced life looking out from the inside. However, for me, the opposite was mostly true. Mm-hmm. in a Windows window washer's perspective, Kathy Lawler says, I was a happy window washer, but the thing is, I'm afraid of heights. And Collette says I had a view into their lives that showed me a myriad of personalities. So what you tell, I think it's an interesting thing to do. It's almost like, um, mental chewing gum to have a little kind of prompt like this that you can kind of walk around thinking, you know, Trying different angles on it. Um, are you gonna write something maybe deeply emotional? Maybe? Maybe funny. Um, what, what is it for doing this for 12 years? What is your kind of response to this whole process of, of these calisthenics?
jill:What's my response to them? Well, I mean,
danny:what do you think it's about? Like you do, you, do you put out these prompts every, every day? What do you think? What's
jill:it, what's it?? Well, when I started Facebook, I just decided to do it differently from everybody else. I wasn't gonna put my ham sandwich that I ate today up, or here I am at the Eiffel Tower. I just decided I wanted to put something that people could participate in and it's fun for me and just. At the beginning, there was just a lot of my writer friends there, so I always gave them prompts, and then it became an addiction, just a, you know, kind of an attention slut. So it's like, here's my thing today. Um, and, and it's just turned out to be so fun. I'd like to make a book out of all of them because they're weird questions. Um, there's, they're not your typical Twitter questions. They're like, if you were a mushroom., you know, how would you have a keynote speech to what would be your keynote speech? So it's . They're just bizarre and I think they're a nice departure from the mundane and the news out there, and people seem to look forward to them.
danny:So it's like the crossword puzzle of the day. Yeah., something like that. Yeah. Creative but more creative than that. Well, good. That was Um, and we have our final department, our final department, which is the subliminal self-talk message of the week. So the subliminal self-talk message of the week is about the thing that you should say to yourself.
jill:So this self-talk is so important to your creativity, cuz you could say either I'm too old or., I'm gonna do this. So we decided that we're gonna leave you with a subliminal message of the week, and it may even show up in other areas just on its own. And I, I think the one for this week is just have fun. So Danny's going to translate that into subliminal. Messages for you?
danny:I am, I'm gonna, I'm gonna try and, uh, try and do that. Um, just have fun. Just have fun. Put this voice into your head. Just have fun. So feel free to come back to this. Three second snippet. Make it your dial tone, make it your ringtone on your phones if you still have that. But just have fun. That's the message for today. Just have fun. Is gonna take us out and take us to the next, um, the, the, the final. Part of our show, which is to say goodbye and to say thank you for, for being part of this experiment. Um, we're gonna hang around a little bit after we stop recording to just discuss day one of doing this, but it was really great to have you here. We will see you next week. Um, feel free again to send us either here in the comments on the YouTube. Or in the, um, in via email. Write to us@podcastsketchbooksschool.com. What are questions that you would like us to address? What are topics that are, that are important to you that you would like our perspective on? We would love to have that as fodder for next week. And of course, we will be selecting one of the questions to win a valuable door prize, which, We will, we have to figure out how we actually get those to people or how we actually get in touch with them. But we'll we'll work that out one way or another. If you asked a question today and we talked about it, you can write to us at podcast@scheduleschool.com and say, that was my question, please. Uh, I need my more . All right, well, thank you so much. And, uh, we are gonna wind this up as the, as the, as the, I think the garbage truck is pulling up outside my house.
jill:Good timing.